uninsulated ground floor slab

[puresemen]

New house bought from PERSIMMON in November 2004. After endless snagging and poor repairs I have discovered that the ground floor does not have insulation built into it. I am a structural engineer and know enough to be dangerous!! There should be 75mm insulation under 75mm screed. We have 150mm screed and the floor is consequently cold to the touch.
We have been complaining about cold and draughts and gas bill is £120 per month!! This will take a little more than simple remedial work to fix. We are currently in discussion about when we can move out for two weeks so that Persimmon can fix poorly installed dry lining and provide the correct insulation to the roof and sloping ceilings on second floor. We really don't want this house any more but are advised that Persimmon don't buy houses back !!
What amazes me is how NHBC inspections were passed - the property does not meet Building Regulations. Has anybody had a similar experience?

[Tony]

Hi Jez,

I don't think it is very common or perhaps most people don't notice.

You should tell your neighbours as neither the NHBC nor the developer will reinspect the rest of the development off their own backs. It is very unlikely that it is just your house that has been affected.

Tony

[Percy Simmon]

Jez,

You are not on your own, i too have a Persimmon NW Home with partial fill insulation in the cavity's, it's hard to heat the house up especially the front part, the temperature never stays the same, it drops all the time coz of draughts coming thru the walls,the closed doors,closed patio doors,closed letterbox,closed window vents/frames,open ended pipework & boxing etc, the Loft insulation aint fitted to the correct depth or across the beams, undersized radiators thru-out, boiler underperforming, etc etc, i've been pushing all these issues for 14 months, as a company they are purely EMBARRASING and it amazes me why the general public keep buying these cardboard boxes, for them to even think a normal chap like me would not notice all these defects is beyond belief, all other Persimmon Homes NW houses on other developments are exactly the same too, not many people pursue things though which is a shame, but not me, i'm carrying on and on and on until my issues are all sorted, which should be in the next couple of months..

Post edited by: Percy Simmon, at: 2006/03/17 08:16

[puresemen]

Tony

Thanks for your thoughts. I am meeting with Persimmon this week and will suggest that they don't want me speaking to the neighbours about this. Hopefully this will provoke some acceptable action. With my recent experiences and hard earnt knowledge I am prepared to offer a free snagging service to all of the owners on the same phase, which is about 30 plots. I am hoping that it won't come to that and the thought of 30 full snagging lists will make Persimmon realise that I mean business!!

[puresemen]

You might be led to believe that part of their established procedure is to try and 'fob you off' if they can get away with it. Many people that I have spoken with have given up trying to get snagging finished beacause it's all so stressful. If they guys they sent had any pride and got the job right first time it would help but we have several jobs that have been continually bodged. I can understand that fixing other people's cock ups is a thankless task though. Keep your chin up and make sure they fix every last item. Perhaps then they may learn that it costs them far more in the long run. The City love Persimmon with their strong share price - I wonder how they would feel if they knew just how much additional cost (and potential profit) is spent on remedial work?!

[tonyw]

Have you asked for an NHBC resolution ? if so how many issues were actually deemed to be breaking any regulations ? people need to remember that houses are built by human beings and not machines, also they are ofton built in our very nice inclemant weather, which in time can cause many differant problems, dont get me wrong, if there is a definate piece of workmanship that is breaking a regulation or is basicaly wrong, then, yes, i agree that has to be sorted out correctly, and before any one asks, yes i am a new house owner, and yes i have had some problems, but i am also a sensible person who realises we do not live in a perfect world, and in the main, ALL the big developers WILL put right what is wrong, there are to many people in this country now living in an american 'where theres blame theres a claim' world, to be honest, in many cases, i think some people have way to much time on there hands, yes, get what you pay for, but i bet a load of the professional whingers dont call there house a load of rubbish when they come to sell it at a massive profit !!!! (ok i am off my soap box now !!!)

Post edited by: tonyw, at: 2006/03/24 23:48

[Jez Collins]

Blimey! Where did that come from? I trust that you are not suggesting that I am some sort of moaner?! I posted my original message because I have serious problems with the build quality of my house and wanted advice. It has now been confirmed by Persimmon customer care that there is no insulation in the ground floor slab - a first for them apparently! I am waiting to see what proposal they will come up with but, for the sake of my wife and three young children, I cannot allow further remedial work to take place. We have already endured over 30 working days of remedial work in 12 months and the only proper solution for the current problem would be to break out the screed on the ground floor and start again - jack hammers in the living room, kitchen and WC taken out etc etc - we have had enough! I have spoken with the NHBC and they aren't interested until Persimmon refuse to take reasonable action to fix this mess. It could be said that if the NHBC inspectors had been doing a thorough job this critical error may have been avoided. As you can tell, I have very little time for the NHBC and believe, like many, that they are the builder's best friend. Some large house builders are getting away with building very poor quality homes (hence this web site) and the public need to be able to speak up about this - with a shortage in skills and more houses required this will only get worse. I am only asking for what I paid for - a reasonably built, safe, warm home - and no more! I am in discussion with two television companies making programmes for the BBC about poorly build homes and have set up a web site to illustrate the problems we have been faced with. This may obviously encourage Persimmon to act promptly (and therefore benefit my family and I) but I hope to be able to help many others in a similar situation by making builders realise that the public will not tollerate the abismal standard of workmanship that is endemic within the industry. Sadly, I work in the construction industry and have to deal with this on a daily basis. This is not intended to be a personal crusade (although it seems like that at times!!) - I merely want a satisfactory conclusion to a very bleak 18 months in a very poorly built house. See attached photograph for proposed web site advertising medium - www.kwality-homes.com is live and content under development.

[puresemen]

Photo couldn't be attached - will try again later [img size=425]http://www.snagging.org/components/com_simpleboard/uploaded/images/PERSIMMONBANNERwebsmall.jpg[/img]

Post edited by: admin, at: 2006/03/25 06:38

[tonyw]

How marvellous !! i trust this sign stays up when you come to sell it ?

in any web site i visit, i always say to myself, 'Tony never reply in a rude or ignorant manner' gotta be honest, i am struggling here at the moment :P ..... whats that thing that opens a door ? .....no not a handle ??? ....ahh thats it......A KNOB !!

I do hope the banner did not cost you to much, as its very likely a waste of money, and i bet allyour neighbours will love you when they are trying to sell there houses !! Whilst they might sympathise for a while, it wont last, and you will find you and your family being ignored and left out of all communial goings on.....dont believe me ? ....wait and see !!:silly:

[puresemen]

tonyw - very subtle. I've a shrewd idea what the 'w' stands for!
If you read the text with the posting you will see that this is a mock-up photo - the banner hasn't gone up. All of the neighbours are having similar issues - our plot is one of 30+ built with little or no site supervision (32 site agents to date!)and any leverage to encourage the builder to act properly would be welcomed by all.
You sure you don't work for Persimmon or NHBC?!